[Famine]

I lack some of the machines Layne uses, and there are a couple other exercises I switched for one reason or another. I'm wondering if anyone sees any problems with these, ie. a bad changes. I want to stay as close to his template as possible.

Here is Layne's routine:

Sunday: Upper Power

-5x5 or 3x5 for all lifts(5x5 on bulk cause recovery is better, 3x5 on cut)
-Barbell Bench Press
-Barbell Rows
-Military Press
-Barbell Shrugs

Monday: Lower Power

-5x5 or 3x5 for all lifts(5x5 on bulk cause recovery is better, 3x5 on cut)
-Back Squat
-Stiff Leg Deadlift, Or Romanian DL
-6-8 sets of Standing Calf, little higher reps, i like to do 6-8 on heavy days

Tues: Off (I usually do some cardio)

Wednesday: Hypertrophy Chest/Arms

(For hypertrophy days i never go to failure, always stop about 2 reps before failure)
-DB Incline Bech 3x8-12
-Barbell Close Grip Bench 3x8-12
-DB Flat Bench 2x8-12
-Preacher Curls 3x8-12 super setted with
-Standing French Press 3x8-12
-Push Downs 3x8-12 super setted with
-DB Hammer Curls
-Cable Crossovers 3x8-12
-Machine Curl 3x8-12 supersetted with
-Machine Dips 3x8-12

Thursday: Hypertrophy Shoulders/Back/Traps
(For hypertrophy days i never go to failure, always stop about 2 reps before failure)

-DB Shoulder Press 3x8-12 super setted with
-DB Front Raise 3x8-12
-DB One Arm Row 3x8-12 super setted with
-DB Arnold Press 3x8-12
-Lat Pull Down (Wide Grip) 2x8-12 super setted with
-DB Shrugs 2x10-15
-Lat Pull Down (Close grip, palms facing in) 2x8-12 super setted with
-DB Upright Row 2x10-15
-T-bar row 2x8-12 (Usually too tired/dead to do this last exercise, but some times i do it)

Friday: Hypertrophy Legs/Calves
(For hypertrophy days i never go to failure, always stop about 2 reps before
failure)

-Hack Squat 5x8-12 super setted with
-Standing Calf 5x10-15
-Leg Extensions 5x10-15 super setted with
-Sitting Leg Curls 5x10-15 super setted with
-Sitting Calf Raise 4x8-12

Saturday: Off (cardio if you want)

For "Wednesday: Hypertrophy Chest/Arms"
*Cable Crossovers >>>to>>> flat DB flys
*Machine Curl >>>to>>> wide-grip EZ bar curls

For "Thursday: Hypertrophy Shoulders/BAck/Traps"
*DB One Arm Row >>>to>>> T-bar row (instead of maybe doing them at the end like Layne says)
*DB Shrugs >>>to>>> deadlift bar shrugs

For "Friday: Hypertrophy Legs/Calves"
*Hack Squats >>>to>>> regular squats




If anyone has any thoughts, I'd love to hear them. I just got back from a long vacation, and started doing this routine today (I started with the Wednesday routine just to see how long that sucker lasts), and so far I really like it. I think I'll make some really good gains.

[Famine]

...and if this should be in the "Training" section, can a MOD please move it there...I was unsure.

Thanks.

[GettinITDone]

It's fine man. You'll want to change them even more eventually as your body becomes used to the exercises (just as you would with any routine). I am also doing Layne's routine and I changed cable crossovers to flies. Remember, this routine worked for Layne (and this isn't exactly what Layne does), but it might not necessarily work for you until you tweak it to fit your body.

[Famine]

Sure, every workout needs to be personalized. My concern was that some of the exercises were replaced with mass movements that were similar to the power routine, not the hypertrphy routine.

[miggitymags]

Check this out:

http://www.bodybuildingdungeon.com/f...tml#post680399

Check out my post (#11); especially the last paragraph.. I highly recommend checking that site out - gives a whole new outlook..

[GettinITDone]

Originally Posted by Famine

For "Wednesday: Hypertrophy Chest/Arms"
*Cable Crossovers >>>to>>> flat DB flys
*Machine Curl >>>to>>> wide-grip EZ bar curls

For "Thursday: Hypertrophy Shoulders/BAck/Traps"
*DB One Arm Row >>>to>>> T-bar row (instead of maybe doing them at the end like Layne says)
*DB Shrugs >>>to>>> deadlift bar shrugs

For "Friday: Hypertrophy Legs/Calves"
*Hack Squats >>>to>>> regular squats

Instead of back squats on power day, do front squats, or visa versa. Why can't you do DB shrugs? And if you can't do CLOSE grip upright rows.

[Famine]

Originally Posted by GettinITDone

Instead of back squats on power day, do front squats, or visa versa. Why can't you do DB shrugs? And if you can't do CLOSE grip upright rows.

I don't like DB shrugs because I can only fit 85 pounds on each DB. With an olympic deadlift/shrug bar, I can actually work the traps with some serious weight.

I can give the front squats and/or hack squats a try...I just don't prefer them to normal squats. I wish I had room in my home gym to buy a hack squat or leg press machine.

[GettinITDone]

Try the close grip upright rows. The close grip will put the focus on the traps more than the delts (whereas as a wider grip would influence the delts). Keep the BB shrugs on the power day. Front squats are great. Put much more emphasis on the quads than back squats, and less on the hams and glutes (than back squats). They take a little bit to get used to because the weight is positioned differently than the back squat. Rest the bar in between your chest and your clavicle and you're good to go. Also, walking BB lunges are great. Hope this helps.

[miggitymags]

Personally, I would keep the 85 lb DB shrugs.. it is a hypertrophy day - not a power day. If you have to do more reps with the 85 lbs, so be it. Focus on slow, concentrated reps, and squeeze for 2-3 seconds at the top, and slowly return to the bottom. I promise 85 lbs will be enough if you do it this way..

I do not like the idea of upright rows to replace DB shrugs - and I am speaking in terms of hitting the peak of your traps. Upright rows are a good trap movements, but the focus isnt on the peak. If you want to include upright rows in your split, that's fine - but it is not a replacement.

I would also stick with BB Squats on power day and do Front Squats on hypertrophy day. If you don't have the room or access to Hack Squats, don't worry about it.. make due with what you have. So you may have to do more sets of front squats. It's about volume... And the bar for front squats should rest on/between your delt and your clavicle..

[projecthatch92]

cosign with miggitty. great post bro

[MikeNYY420]

For the deadlift shrugs, you're not planning on doing shrugs with a mixed grip are you?

[Famine]

Originally Posted by MikeNYY420

For the deadlift shrugs, you're not planning on doing shrugs with a mixed grip are you?

No, the bar I have has the hand grips to the side, in the same position as if I were doing DB shrugs. That's why I thought about using it...it is the exact same motion.

[Famine]

Originally Posted by miggitymags

Personally, I would keep the 85 lb DB shrugs.. it is a hypertrophy day - not a power day. If you have to do more reps with the 85 lbs, so be it. Focus on slow, concentrated reps, and squeeze for 2-3 seconds at the top, and slowly return to the bottom. I promise 85 lbs will be enough if you do it this way..

I do not like the idea of upright rows to replace DB shrugs - and I am speaking in terms of hitting the peak of your traps. Upright rows are a good trap movements, but the focus isnt on the peak. If you want to include upright rows in your split, that's fine - but it is not a replacement.

I would also stick with BB Squats on power day and do Front Squats on hypertrophy day. If you don't have the room or access to Hack Squats, don't worry about it.. make due with what you have. So you may have to do more sets of front squats. It's about volume... And the bar for front squats should rest on/between your delt and your clavicle..

Good pointers, thanks. I'll stick with front squats.

Quick question, what percent weight of regualar squats should a person be lifting for front squats? I'm guessing it's less, but by how much? I want to know if I'm sandbagging.

[Famine]

Originally Posted by miggitymags

Personally, I would keep the 85 lb DB shrugs.. it is a hypertrophy day - not a power day. If you have to do more reps with the 85 lbs, so be it. Focus on slow, concentrated reps, and squeeze for 2-3 seconds at the top, and slowly return to the bottom. I promise 85 lbs will be enough if you do it this way..

You know...I've been wanting to get some bigger DB bars. This is a great reason. If I get the longer ones (an inche or two), I can get an extra 20 pounds on each one. I might be able to work with 105# DB. Layne says on his hypertrophy days to do 8-12 reps and stop 2 reps before failure. Even doing 3 second squeezes at the top, I could do 85# DB shugs all day long.

[miggitymags]

Originally Posted by Famine

Good pointers, thanks. I'll stick with front squats.

Quick question, what percent weight of regualar squats should a person be lifting for front squats? I'm guessing it's less, but by how much? I want to know if I'm sandbagging.

the obvious answer is: it depends. since you are doing squats for power and sticking to a 5x5 (or 3x5) layout, its fairly consistent. but with front squats, you are doing these on hypertrophy days - and you should be periodizing.. in other words, switching up your rep ranges every 2-4 weeks.

for me, for example --- squats: 325, 5x5; front squats: 250, 3x6.. lower body obviously isnt my strength..

Originally Posted by Famine

You know...I've been wanting to get some bigger DB bars. This is a great reason. If I get the longer ones (an inche or two), I can get an extra 20 pounds on each one. I might be able to work with 105# DB. Layne says on his hypertrophy days to do 8-12 reps and stop 2 reps before failure. Even doing 3 second squeezes at the top, I could do 85# DB shugs all day long.

You are a machine..

Maybe try them seated... it will take away any momentum powered through your lower half.. just an idea.

[projecthatch92]

yea seated for sure.

[MikeNYY420]

Oh... it's not the same thing, the weights are on the sides of you and not in front of you. This changes the muscle worked slightly. I think it makes it easier, why not just do normal deadlifts.

[Famine]

Originally Posted by MikeNYY420

Oh... it's not the same thing, the weights are on the sides of you and not in front of you. This changes the muscle worked slightly. I think it makes it easier, why not just do normal deadlifts.

I probably shot out too many questions because some of this is running together...my fault.

I'm not replacing the barbell shrugs with the side grip trap bar; I was considering using that bar in place of dumbbell shrugs. Because, yes, those two movements achieve very different results.

That said, I am going to use DB (as soon as I get them) for the DB shrugs.

[MikeNYY420]

Sounds good

[GettinITDone]

Originally Posted by miggitymags

Personally, I would keep the 85 lb DB shrugs.. it is a hypertrophy day - not a power day. If you have to do more reps with the 85 lbs, so be it. Focus on slow, concentrated reps, and squeeze for 2-3 seconds at the top, and slowly return to the bottom. I promise 85 lbs will be enough if you do it this way..

I do not like the idea of upright rows to replace DB shrugs - and I am speaking in terms of hitting the peak of your traps. Upright rows are a good trap movements, but the focus isnt on the peak. If you want to include upright rows in your split, that's fine - but it is not a replacement.

I would also stick with BB Squats on power day and do Front Squats on hypertrophy day. If you don't have the room or access to Hack Squats, don't worry about it.. make due with what you have. So you may have to do more sets of front squats. It's about volume... And the bar for front squats should rest on/between your delt and your clavicle..

The only reason I said upright rows is that BB shrugs do work the peak of the traps, and so do DB shrugs (?), so why not swap in a new movement.

And yeah, delt and clavicle (which I guess will run across the upper-most portion of the chest). Sorry, it was late last night.

[Famine]

I just got done with Layne's hypertrophy leg & calves day. I did the hack squats (even though they are not my favorite) and everything was pretty standard for a leg day; no big surprises.

[projecthatch92]

Yeah the hack squats aren't my favorite either. If your gym has one of the HAmmer Strength power squat machines, do the hack squat with that. If your gym does indeed have it, you'll know what I'm talking about. Makes it much more enjoyable

[Famine]

Originally Posted by projecthatch92

Yeah the hack squats aren't my favorite either. If your gym has one of the HAmmer Strength power squat machines, do the hack squat with that. If your gym does indeed have it, you'll know what I'm talking about. Makes it much more enjoyable

My gym is in my home, so not a lot of machines. I am however thinking about getting a leg press of some sort in the near future.

[projecthatch92]

wouldn't it be cheaper to join a local gym instead of getting a leg press?

[Famine]

Originally Posted by projecthatch92

wouldn't it be cheaper to join a local gym instead of getting a leg press?

Well, not really. Three years at Power House would pay for the leg press machine I'm looking at. I did the gym scene for 5-6 years and got tired of sharing machines, listening to crappy music, and watching people with really bad form.

Besides, I love working out at home. I built a dedicated gym room complete with heat, air, carpet, rubber mats, mirrors, stereo system, fans, a heavy bag, and a speed bag. Plus I've already got several thousand wrapped up in Body Solid equipment: power rack with cabe pullies, incline/flat/decline bench, preacher curl station, sitting calf raise station, all the bars, 500 pounds of olympic weight, and 200 pounds of standard weight. And an eliptical bike to boot. My only issue is space...if I can fit it in, I'll buy a compact leg press.

[MikeNYY420]

Do you guys think doing a squeeze at the top does anything besides bring lactic acid to the muscle? I've never tried it, but it doesn't seem too beneficial.

[Famine]

Originally Posted by MikeNYY420

Do you guys think doing a squeeze at the top does anything besides bring lactic acid to the muscle? I've never tried it, but it doesn't seem too beneficial.

If we're talking shrugs, I don't usually go out of my way to squeeze at the top unless the weight is too light for some reason and I want to add a little burn.

[projecthatch92]

Originally Posted by Famine

If we're talking shrugs, I don't usually go out of my way to squeeze at the top unless the weight is too light for some reason and I want to add a little burn.

Cosign. I only squeeze when I'm doing 15 or more reps

[MikeNYY420]

Roighto, just making sure I'm not missing out on some great new discovery haha.

[projecthatch92]

well there is this one thing, but I can't tell you, it's kind of top secret lol.

hey famine, I know you workout at home, but yesterday I added in 5x5 of pec deck at the end of my upper body power day, and holy cow the burn was sick.