[juniormuscle]

Hey,

I will just introduce myself,

I am new to the site,

I have been training for 4 years,

I am currently 224lbs height 6ft 2in bf 14%

I have been using anabolics for a year now and have made some extremely good gains

However due to my dodgy nervous system i am very sensitive to stimulation of the nervous system

My heart rate increases in contractility force and bpm aswell, also i experience irregular heart beats,

This i beleive is related to pshycological side effects and nervous system exitation that occurs when using steroids,

I have managed to find a solution to the problem.....Valium!

I have been using this now for 4 months and taper up down then off to avoid drug dependancy,

I am currently cruising at 500mg test and taking 1.25-2.5 mg of valium

This is all well and good but there are issues,

where it depresses the cns(central nervous system)my muscles feel heavy and weak
they dont feel as pumped and it completely kills libido(No sign of life on the planet)

also i was wondering since its slowing the body down that somehow that would slow down/surpress protein synthesis.

I can only use test but i want to drop water and fat so test is obviousely not the best,i can handle eq but that still aromatises with less effective gains.


I have tried lowering the dose to a small amount but find the increase in hr and irregular beats irritating.

I was wondering if anyone has had this same situation and if anyone uses valium how much do you take to inhibit anxiety but not depress the nervous system too much that it affects strength.

My goal is to allow my body enough stimulus to allow me to get a good pump and allow the nervous system enough stimulus to be strong and produce strength gains but calm my body so that my heart/anxiety side is surpressed.

I am very serious about bodybuilding and want to progress past this technicality that is holding me back.i am determined to find a balance that will allow me to knock down these walls!

Annother thing i have noticed is the more that a particular steroid binds to the androgen receptor the more irregular the heartbeat(eq progestins deca tren worst offenders,then winstrol,masteron,then eq,then test)test i still have problems with but it seems to be more increased hr than ireegular beats which is better.

I was considering switching to igf1s and growth to see if they cause the same sides!but i am only 20 so i am unsure wether i should start on the growth yet

I beleive anabolics exert their exitory properties through the gaba a receptor and effect the balance between parasympathetic and sympathetic tone

If there is anyone on the site who can help or share expereinces that you feel would help me get past this obsticle i would be greatful

[mindstar]

well it seems like you're very well read about the drugs you are on, and are paying attention to how they affect you, which is awesome...however, at 20, and only 225 @14% you are too young, and no where near your genetic potential yet. Your endocrine system is not benefitting from your early use of AAS, and accelerated heart beat is nothing to take lightly...how is your BP?

In all honesty, I would avoid experimenting with self medication right now and see an MD and get your blood work done. Then I'd hit the gym using food for at least a year or two before thinking about AAS again.

Good luck bro,

[juniormuscle]

Thanks for the advice,


Appart from the endocrine problems which i am ok with why else is it bad to use anabolics at 20?

And when you say increased hr is not to be taken lightly,... im not taking it lightly thats why i am seeking advice and trying new things,my heart rate never goes near my maximum hr (220-20=200)

fastest it has ever been rested is round about 100bpm(i was weighing238 and carrying alot of water and no doubt bp was elevated slightly prolly 140 over 75 also i wasnt using valium so my anxiety was high

i have anxiety issues anyway with or without anabolics and have used ssris(prozac)previous to valium(the valium seems to be working efficiently at surpressing anxiety anyway and i dont get bothered by things that much anymore)

about 120 when i come of a sun bed(man that takes it out of me,10 mins on the lamps and im screwed!lol!)


morning(even on gear 65-70)

my bp is 130 over 70(that on a cycle, off is 120-130 over 66)

i have had ecgs and 24 hr heart monitor done,and results have come back completely normal,

no murmors,no enlargements,no probs at all

i dont get any light headedness i dont get any pain in the chest and i dont feel out of breath

in a sentence i do not have a heart condition, i may get one or two missed beats in morning and maybe 1 or two during training(depending on how stressed or anxious i am)sometimes i can go about 5 days without any irregular beats and then bam! i get a couple!

with the valium i get maybe 1 day a week where i miss one or two beats and training my heart rate is regukar all week so it seems to be an anxiety/chemical imbalance.

and when im off anabolics my hr is slow like 60-70bpm and about 110-120bpm whilst training when im on its about 80-85 and training 130-145bpm(loud and occasionally skipped)

Cardio on:140-170 high speed run

Cardio off:130-150 high speed run

Cardio on w valium:130-145 high speed run(dragging my sedated ass as fast as i can on the treadmill before i fall over)lol(lower hr due to less intensity/effort)

when using valium and anabolics my heart rate is 50-60bpm resting and 110-120bpm training(not loud and less often irregular)

anyway i think thats enough info to give you the full picture!

so my question is as i have no heart condition and i have a cure for my symptoms that enables me to grow,if i am not in any danger of cardiovascular disease then the only thing left is the question of will the valium kill my gains(with reference to the above about protein synthesis and strength?


i understand i am nowhere near my genetic potential yet and am eating well and training hard too

i am dedicated to the sport and want to take my body to its ultimate potential

i want to be competing by about 22-23 at competition weight of about 235-240lbs(shredded and hard with a classic granit look)

the valium works but i want to push strength up without sacrificing heart rate!

like i said anyone else must have faced the same sides(or am i the only guy on the planet with this)

[Diesel]

Reminder for Teens considering using...

[juniormuscle]

Thanks for the post deisel,

much appreciated advice,

i never researched the endocrine system and can also see that maybe my central nervous system and brain havent matured yet(that could be a big factor in the palpitations)i kind of assumed that because my freinds can handle it that my body could,does that just mean their nervous system has developed more than mine?
But realistically i have been on for a duration of a year now and surely my nervous system and endocrine system is beyond repair?

I will prolly run till end of summer(as i may as well see it through,and dont fancy being completely impotent in the mating season!lol)but i think as the winter comes around thats its back the the drawing board!.

will ditch the drugs for and stick to the basics until 25 now.

honestly i cant see myself putting on another pound of muscle now until then but if im not at my genetic potential then maybe i will?

[mindstar]

food brother, food.

And have you been continuously on for a whoe year or have you done several 15 weekers? If you've been continually on, i suggest you stop now, and save the gear...and really take care to do PCT properly.

[juniormuscle]

I did 2 8 on 8 off cycles of sustanon and deca and then i used primo winstrol eq for 8 weeks(i just experimented to see wich drugs gave me the worst sides(but used an anabolic dose!) then i have been on for about 22 weeks now,so correction on saying i have been on for 4 months its more like 5 and a half!(started early february)

WEEKS 1-12 i used alot of test800mgpw,then13-16used 500mg pw17-22 i am cruising at 1 sustanon250mg per week and arimidex .25pday just to keep in an anabolic state whilst dieting down all the water bloat and changing cycles

was planning on eq600 winstrol 50mgpd and prop50ed
for 12 weeks then back to natural for a long time!!!
i have done my first shot this week so i will try come off next week!

why come off now?my cholesterol is in check through garlic fish oils,minimal amount of saturated fats and whole grains,my bp is normal because im on such a small dose it doesnt really elevate eostrogen levels ect,my cv fitness is fine also,i know the longer i stay on the more i will be surpressed but i really dont want to be surpressed for summer(that has started now and i have just met a hot girl !!!) is it bad to stay on for this long(health wise)at such a low dose(almost hrt dose!) or is it just the fact that it surpresses the hpta?

i was thinking...(and tell me if you think this sound stupid and counterproductive)how about running 1 sustanon250 with a small amount of hcg through summer(250iu x 2 pw)just to maintain a state of anabolism whilst get the natural hormones back online and then hitting a full pct in september of say 250-500iu pd for a week then 250iu twice or three times pw for a following 3 weeks then clomid therapy(i think the arimidx im taking should assist clomid therapy as it wont have to battle with excess eostrogen,

what do you suggest for pct for such a long cycle and will such a small amount of test really upset my cholesterol if i have a good diet?i know the arimidx will!!!but with a good diet im sure i can counteract that right?

[mindstar]

I think Twitch or rocco will be able to answer this better than I can...