Afganistan troop surge

KM · 03-11-2009, 06:23 PM

New U.S. troops in Afghanistan see combat

LOGAR PROVINCE, Afghanistan — Close to 3,000 American soldiers who recently arrived in Afghanistan to secure two violent provinces near Kabul have begun operations and already are seeing combat, the unit's spokesman said Monday.

The new troops are the first wave of an expected surge of reinforcements this year.

U.S. commanders have been contemplating sending up to 30,000 more soldiers to bolster the 33,000 already here, but the Obama administration is expected to initially approve only a portion of that number. White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said Monday that the president would decide soon.

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Extra forces could stay in Afghanistan 5 years

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/...ops/index.html

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Gen. David McKiernan, commander of U.S. and NATO forces in Afghanistan, predicted Wednesday that the additional 17,000 U.S. military forces to be sent to Afghanistan will remain there for as long as five years.

"This is not a temporary force uplift," McKiernan said. "It will need to be sustained for some period of time, for the next three to four to five years."

KM · 03-11-2009, 07:20 PM

With this article, I think it's easy to say that America is definitely spreading itself way too thin. Like I mentioned in another thread, the afghan approval rating it pitiful and by sending more probably won't win them over. In theory, if we could have focused our military power on Afghanistan and captured the people responsible for 9/11, we probably could have been out of there a lot time ago.

Our resources are depleting and we will inevitably need to cut back on our troops. But when?

Chuck · 03-11-2009, 08:12 PM

Yea They are getting stretched thin, I agree and lots pulling more than three tours, If one of my friends hadn't gotten injured he'd be over there on his fourth tour. luckily it was a bad injury. I"m sure the increase in troops is really going to piss them off, probably just putting troops over there just to get closer to Iran.

RAGEN2008 · 03-11-2009, 10:00 PM

Considering those people have had a religious war for the last 2,000+ years, I'd say they won't cut back until they figure out you can't win a war where the people just wait for you to leave their country then walk up to a bus full of kids and blow themselves up.

The whole situation is really no better than when we first invaded iraq. The main thing is our country better or worse off than before this war? Obviously it has screwed our economy and netted practically no results. The scum bags just moved from one place to another. Next we'll be at war with Iran and unlike the guys that just run around with ak-47's and shoot at you in the dark Iran will fight back and has an actual military.

Is America safer because we went to Iraq and the middle east and fought over there? Not even.

KM · 03-11-2009, 11:44 PM

An excerpt on the rationale behind the surge:

"The aims of the surge were to disarm sectarian militias, integrate Sunni forces into the predominantly Shia government, and buy time for Iraq's communities to agree on the distribution of oil revenues."

External meddling is not going to stabilize the two countries and instead of disarming the sectarian armies we've actually aided and strengthened them. Afghanistan is much more complex than Iraq, and quite honestly, the surge will not work. Progress is almost inherently impossible! But like most of America's problems, we destroyed it and scramble for ways to conform and rebuild what was destroyed.

RAGEN2008 · 03-12-2009, 06:50 PM

No one is perfect, but the problem is when the government fuk's up, it costs a LOT of money and a LOT of lives when war is involved. Some expert making decisions doesn't mean it's going to be a success and many American's have come to this thing that we are superior militarily and just go in an kick peoples a$$es.

Obviously that's not what's happening and now they figure, oh wow what happened this isn't working, plan b time. That's great, but after how many lives were lost and how many million/billions later?

Call it a stalemate and let those people kill each other, bring our family and friends home where they belong.

KM · 03-12-2009, 11:57 PM

exactly. imagine if we were running low on troops...then what...

Military draft.

RAGEN2008 · 03-13-2009, 06:37 PM

Give me an m-16 and I'll keep it loaded and protect my own family and if I see a terrorist on my block I'll gun his ass down, hows that for homeland security

It's a lot cheaper than going to Iraq and Afghanistan.

KM · 03-13-2009, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RAGEN2008

Give me an m-16 and I'll keep it loaded and protect my own family and if I see a terrorist on my block I'll gun his ass down, hows that for homeland security

lol... I was just thinking something along these lines. Stocking up on ammo and guns probably isn't the worst idea; It acts somewhat like a deterrent.

RAGEN2008 · 03-14-2009, 04:24 PM

The thing is all this war on terror BS is BS. Where is the big surge of attacks in America? Since 9-11 not a damn thing has really happened. A person can go out take 5 guns to their local school and kill 50+ people easy. How the hell can you prevent that?

If we actually had our troops and police, patrolling our cities we might actually be able to do something about the crime that happens every day in our city streets.

Hell a while back some kid went to the middle school and shot some kid in the head because he was gay. If we can't keep guns off our own middle school campuses how the hell do we defend our country when we're fighting 1/2 way around the world when a real group of psychos decides today we're going to hi-jack every city bus and blow them up or send a guy to every church and blow it up.

When you think about it, it's very scary how unsafe we really are. If the world went mad and people started killing each other, how the hell would you stop it? The thing people don't realize is, the government isn't going to your door and hand you food and protection when the sh*t hits the fan.

Look at hurricane Katrina, it took days to do things, and people died. The reality is, our country is not prepared for serious attacks or disasters. The best protection is self protection and self preparation.

ChrisX · 03-15-2009, 09:41 AM

Guys i was planning on joining the marine corps. But you know after everyone tells you what its all really about and how your treated like a number (this came from people in the marines), I have my doubts now. Whats sad is 19 year old kids dieing for trying to better themselves... What part of the constitution are they fighting for in Iraq? Hmmmmmmmmmm.......

Chuck · 03-15-2009, 11:19 AM

Interesting COmments you got here well first off the surge in Iraq worked don't know where your getting your info from but I get mine all the way from privates and seargents in the Marines to a seargent and special forces leutenant in the army and a few Marine pilots. There is a reason we haven't been attacked since 9-11, people are doing their job. The real threat is the drug cartels on the border, More people died in 1 year in Juarez than all the years in Iraq, Thats more than 6,000 dead in one year, and we are over 1,000 dead already this year and its coming across the border. These are people aren't looking for work either.
I personally believe pull all our troops home put them on the borders and say screw every other country out there and lets see who survives the wars, right now there a bigger threats than Afghanistan, but it is nice to have troops there closer to Iran than in Iraq, Just a thought.
If you haven't started stocking up on ammo now, you better start because the price tag on that is deffinately going up between 3 and 10 times as much the way Obama is going. If cap and trade go through everybody is going to be paying through the roof thats going to increase your bill by at least 3x (Obama Admits Cap & Trade Will Cause Electricity Rates to Skyrocket | The Minority Report) might want to do more research to verify for yourselves.
For Chrix- If your worried about beeing treated like a number, you are until you prove yourself, everybody starts off as a number to the higher ups, to your brotherhood you serve with you keep eacher other alive and depend on each other for that very fact. The marines will teach you to do more with less, you make less with the marines, the marines get shafted when it comes to equipment. I could tell you lots on how its good and how its bad, simple fact is you need to figure out why you would be joining, thats four years of your life.
These are just my opinions and comments everybody has the right to their own. Make sure you do research and investigate both sides of everything, war, economy, and everything else in life.

RAGEN2008 · 03-15-2009, 04:47 PM

I'd have to some what disagree. We might have secured areas when we invaded Iraq, but the war just moved to a new place and we're in Afghanistan now and who knows where after that, closer and closer to Iran?

I thought the whole reason we went there was to get Osama? Where is he?

As far as us not getting attacked because people are doing their jobs, I can't agree we're much safer. Besides adding more security at airports, it is just as easy to do a terrorist attack. Having more rent-a-cops at transportation stations doesn't stop terrorism.

Before 9-11 how many terrorist attacks did we have and how often? A nut job and group of nut jobs will always be around to commit some random attack of violence. As far as our country being safer, not even close. It is estimated that California will be spending more on prisons than its education system and that figure is supposed to happen in less than 5 years or so.

Someone can walk down the street right now and walk into a mall and kill 50+ people before the cops would even show up. You simply can't prevent a crazy person from going crazy. Reducing threats, helping to prevent, sure with what cameras?

If someone wants to come to our country, obtain weapons and hurt people, if they have money and the connections it is going to happen.

On the borders I agree 100%, we need to get troops down there and unload on their ass. Americans dying and getting kidnapped in our own country is fing BS. I might sound like an A-hole, but the people in Iraq and Afghanistan need to get off their ass and protect their own country and we need to get our people back to help defend ours.

Chuck · 03-16-2009, 12:45 AM

Raggen,

Don't worry you ain't no a hole everybody has a different point of view and I listen to them all, thats whats great about this country. I should have been more specific about us and what preventative measures the us took to prevent another terrorist attack, I think it was good that the agencies finally started working together and start getting rid of a little red tape. The airports, rent a cops, border, checkpoints, i don't think that works either. On the surge, I'm going on friends testimonies and other people that have been over there, I don't trust the news, but I'm sure in some areas it hasn't worked. Oh well I think afgahnistan is an excuse to get closer to Iran, oh well we'll see. i got other opinions but I'll share for another day, lol

RAGEN2008 · 03-16-2009, 11:55 AM

I really hope we don't go to war with Iran. Unlike the scattered yahoo's popping off shots in the night, Iran has a pretty decent military. One thing is for sure, we'd lose more than a few thousand troops.

As to the surge, sending in a lot more people helped secure and clear out areas, but now the scum bags just went to a new place and regrouped. Now they have the nut jobs in those places to join up with them.

I come from and have active military family members and as nice as I can say it, we should have dropped the bomb and called it a day

KM · 03-19-2009, 12:30 AM

Cutting down on our external military forces seems like a decent remedy for the recession in my opinion. Thought?

RAGEN2008 · 03-22-2009, 03:06 PM

I'm really interested when they are going to call it a day period, win, lose, draw, whatever they want to call it and end this war. Trying to eliminate all terrorist activity in entire countries is a little hard to do when people make bombs and carry ak-47's.

Reducing government spending on the war and putting that money back into our economy would help, but one thing with a lot of recessions they usually lower taxes, while we're looking at increased taxes, I think California is looking at moving up 1% or so in state tax also.

I honestly think the government at this time has no idea what exactly to do to fix our situation. Plans, ideas, sure, but ask them will this work for sure and they all say the same thing, I hope so, it should

Either way one thing can't be denied, ending American casualties is of the highest priority. My vote, bring the troops home, fix our home situations, secure our homelands and then worry about people 1/2 around the world.

**EastCoast Highlander** · 03-31-2009, 12:39 AM

wait long enough and there will be a war here... all Americans! learn your state firearms laws! ignorance is how the government will rob you of your lives and liberty, educate yourself!

RAGEN2008 · 04-01-2009, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EastCoast Highlander

wait long enough and there will be a war here... all Americans! learn your state firearms laws! ignorance is how the government will rob you of your lives and liberty, educate yourself!

Man we've been at war. You walk down the street and have a bunch of thugs want to beat your ass because they don't like how you look or you're not from their area. There are plenty of areas in the US that should be labeled war zones. If you can't go some place just because it is night that's a good start to all out kaos if you ask me.

We won't even talk about how much sh*t will hit the fan if our economy really collapses and you have 20+% of people out of work, when there is no money to pay rent, no food and no water, which for some people is only a few pay checks away, it will be a sad and scary day.

**Genghis** · 04-02-2009, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RAGEN2008

Man we've been at war. You walk down the street and have a bunch of thugs want to beat your ass because they don't like how you look or you're not from their area. There are plenty of areas in the US that should be labeled war zones. If you can't go some place just because it is night that's a good start to all out kaos if you ask me.

We won't even talk about how much sh*t will hit the fan if our economy really collapses and you have 20+% of people out of work, when there is no money to pay rent, no food and no water, which for some people is only a few pay checks away, it will be a sad and scary day.

The G20's looking an absolute disaster and a stab in the dark.. Im sure its gone past a matter of "if"..., its funny I knew for a long time the global economy was gunna absolutely fall apart... I read it quite some time ago in a book, but I dont wanna bring the illuminati stuff into this thread, but I look its really wrong that american troops are dying and same goes for the innocent people getting slaughtered in afghanistan etc. but its gone past ridiculous now, Americas objective was to get a so called crazed looney with a beard running around the caves of afghanistan.. they couldnt get him hmmmm... I find that a little strange then some other so called moves to help iraq... fair enough they got saddam... but at what cost? left a country worser off than it was with a tyrrant?

Seriously... take a second Americans & patriots alike... there's more than like 80 million muslims or by todays standards "terrorists" in the world... think about it seriously... if muslims reaallly that badly wanted to attack the west and kill infidels you think that 9/11 would've been the last of attacks.. man you guys would be getting attacked aloooootttttttttttt.. trust me lol... its a little fishy dont ya'll think?, its strange how even with the new so called security procedures not even one alarm has been raised since 9/11... people still believe 9/11 was some nutty muslim extremeists who thought one day, why dont I go grab a plane and slam it through the twin towers, I dont care if you guys dont believe your own goverment did it or not,

What I am gunna say is Americans... look out for yourselves and your own families, screw the goverment, they are messing up and just kicking your country to pieces, look Im not here to be some sort of piece maker.. its obvious propaganda has made islam look like a real evil thing also how the typical zionist news has made iraq, iran etc. look like some backwards cavemen style people... but really if that was the case then why dont america stop sending troops let other countries tear themselves apart and look after there own troops and put up higher security.

I wanna post more but errr.. my protein shakes been sitting in my kitchen for like 15 minutes now, I want to say I got no beef or bias towards america.. with a more honest better government you lot would be back to the high sparkling respected country of freedom... but you guys are in dark times... and repeatedly blaming terrorists and islam.. is getting a little tiresome.. to say the least...

RAGEN2008 · 04-02-2009, 11:46 AM

The government always uses, "the sky is falling". They find something to focus your fears to and say hey we need to do this or you're all going to die a horrible death, so you want to stand behind and support them.

The war on drugs, the war on terror, the war on the economy. We are losing the fight against all of these and they just switch focus to which ever is the worst at the time.

Before it was drugs, we still have drug dealing EVERY where, then the focus was terrorists and we're still at war with no real end in sight years later and never got Osama, now with our country falling apart it's rebuilding the economy and that is already being screwed up with misuse of monies given to large businesses who are spending it on bonuses while unemployment climbs daily. The real problem is the government is too big, we have too many ideas and spend too much trying to make all of these things work.

Our country's single and foremost focus should be housing, food, health care, employment and security within our country. We have no business in Afghanistan period. We need more police and more jobs. It is sad that our country will spend more money on 1-2 people locked up a year than a police officer makes. FYI California will be spending more on it's prison system than it does on education within the next few years.

America needs to learn you clean out your own closet before you go and help someone take care of their problems. They need to fix what's wrong with America first, period.

**Genghis** · 04-02-2009, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RAGEN2008

The government always uses, "the sky is falling". They find something to focus your fears to and say hey we need to do this or you're all going to die a horrible death, so you want to stand behind and support them.

The war on drugs, the war on terror, the war on the economy. We are losing the fight against all of these and they just switch focus to which ever is the worst at the time.

Before it was drugs, we still have drug dealing EVERY where, then the focus was terrorists and we're still at war with no real end in sight years later and never got Osama, now with our country falling apart it's rebuilding the economy and that is already being screwed up with misuse of monies given to large businesses who are spending it on bonuses while unemployment climbs daily. The real problem is the government is too big, we have too many ideas and spend too much trying to make all of these things work.

Our country's single and foremost focus should be housing, food, health care, employment and security within our country. We have no business in Afghanistan period. We need more police and more jobs. It is sad that our country will spend more money on 1-2 people locked up a year than a police officer makes. FYI California will be spending more on it's prison system than it does on education within the next few years.

America needs to learn you clean out your own closet before you go and help someone take care of their problems. They need to fix what's wrong with America first, period.

Totally agree with you Ragen, its funny how politicians make out that running country's is hard but really in the end it boils down to simple things like looking after your own, work for betterment & dont put your nose in other countries businesses...

I know its pointless saying this... but there is a smalll glimmer of a hope in the G20... some positives has come out of it today... $1.1 trillion, I just seriously hope the global economy gets a huge boost out of the money.. but the fact that some countries are still refusing to trade with each other... leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.. we need more jobs and better education at the moment, britain and america alike..

RAGEN2008 · 04-02-2009, 10:26 PM

I just want to see this war over. Over 4,000 dead. That's 4,000 mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, sons and daughters, nieces and nephews, cousins and friends that are all gone because some sorry ass mother fker went and did some stupid sh*t to someone that never did a damn thing to them.

It's also sad how we invaded that country. Everyone there isn't some religious nut, a lot of the iraq people that had nothing to do with the war also lost their lives.

Now North Korea is testing rockets. I'm just waiting to wake up on morning and see WWIII. I hope they can come to some sort of resolution to the problems, but it is years later and we are still at war.

Just so you know we've been at war longer than WWII took. This crap is really dragging out.