[Ethos]

Hi guys, how does my diet look?


8.30 Protein shake / baguel or oats / Banana or grapes

10.30 Chicken and brown rice or potato

12.00 Homemade protein bar (340cal roughly)

2.00 Chicken and brown rice or potato

4.15 Protein shake / oats

5.30-6.30 Train

6.30 "gain" shake (protein with carbs)

7.30 Varies, normally a meat with rice and some veg

9.00 Protein shake

10.30 Quark cheese with a little milk

I know that's rough and calories aren't stated :(


Wouldn't mind losing some fat as I think I'm currently sitting around 15%. Down to 10/11% would be nice. Sitting at just under 210lbs most of the time. Would it be worth me adding 20 minutes of cardio on my off days in the morning for my goal? What are you opinions on cardio for minimal muscle loss?

I'm also thinking about putting some oats in my shake at 9ish.

I was reading your posts on the bodybuilding.com forums str8flexed about too much protein as was wondering if I perhaps am getting a little too much.

[AlteredBeast]

Number one; you need to prioritize. Do you want to Gain Muscle or Lose Fat, cause doing either one or the other is a more optimal plan. If you are trying to gain mass with the expectations of eventually slimming down to a sveltte 10% or lower, then this diet will work for you. If you want to slim down immeadiately then you better realize that you're not naturally thin and therefore you can't eat so many calories. You won't lose a damn thing on the current diet you're on now. I recently just finished my diet that I've been slaving over for over a year and half and I've discovered a few things about losing weight. I have a few rules you may want to incorperate into your regimine that has led to controlled, muscle-saving fat-loss.
First off, Reduce your carbs. The only time you need carbs is when you eat your first meal, and before and after you train. That's it, no more, no less(for now).

Second, Restrict ALL carb sources to strictly slow-digesting alternatives, meaning cut out the bagels, the breads, the pastas, the cereals, and starchy foods(White Potatoes-Red Potatoes-Corn, etc.)

Never Eat carbs and dietary fats at the same time. Split them up.

To keep mass while dieting-eat more red meat(Extremely lean 96/4% hamburger-Lean Top Round)

To lean out faster eat "cleaner" sources of protein (chicken breasts-turkey breasts-etc.etc.) and further reduce carbs.

Take EFA's To keep sanity, Brain function, memory, Joint health, Expidited Fat oxidation, and for Anti-catabolism purposes. (protection against muscle wasting)

Consume as much protein as your body can handle w/o getting digestion problems and as long as you have no bad kidney history. ALL CLEAN SOURCES.

Limit food intake to MOSTLY whole food meals and place less emphasis on artificial meals.

Absolutely NO_SUGAR_PERIOD!!! No Fruit, No Candy, No anything sugary! Yeah those grapes you like to eat...Kiss them goodbye.

Make sure your water intake is high (1-1/2 gallons worth) Ilove crystal light personally.

And Cardio....You absolutely have to do cardio period. Start with once in the morning before you eat a damn thing and do 30 minutes 5 days a week for the first few weeks. Then gradually increase that number to 45 minutes 6 days a week. Then monitor from there how much fat you still need to lose.

Final Words...you're doing this natural and don't be surprised if your fat doesn't just melt. You're not taking winstrol, deca, etc. so therefore don't expect "magazine" type of reductions.

These are just guidelines not absolutes...your body is different from mine so see if these things work for you. Remember dieting is a motherfucker-no way around it. You can either do it and reap the fruits of your labor, or you can go the easy way and not have shit to show under your shirt. Your choice bro, good luck.

[Cerberus]

I woukld base alot of my foods on the satiety index(google it).

You could diet on coke and pizza if you want to, just depends on your energybalance.

Eat less than u expend(not to any extremity), watch the mirror, scale and strength-stats in the gym and your good to go.

Personally I include an eating day every week where I bascially eat whatever I want(and that's usually candy and icecream). It takes a little longer to diet but it keeps me sane.

Also decide what to focus on, get ripped or to build maximum amount of muscle. You can't do both at the same time efficient if you're not on drugs.

[PWRofONE]

Originally Posted by AlteredBeast

Number one; you need to prioritize. Do you want to Gain Muscle or Lose Fat, cause doing either one or the other is a more optimal plan. If you are trying to gain mass with the expectations of eventually slimming down to a sveltte 10% or lower, then this diet will work for you. If you want to slim down immeadiately then you better realize that you're not naturally thin and therefore you can't eat so many calories. You won't lose a damn thing on the current diet you're on now. I recently just finished my diet that I've been slaving over for over a year and half and I've discovered a few things about losing weight. I have a few rules you may want to incorperate into your regimine that has led to controlled, muscle-saving fat-loss.
First off, Reduce your carbs. The only time you need carbs is when you eat your first meal, and before and after you train. That's it, no more, no less(for now).

Second, Restrict ALL carb sources to strictly slow-digesting alternatives, meaning cut out the bagels, the breads, the pastas, the cereals, and starchy foods(White Potatoes-Red Potatoes-Corn, etc.)

Never Eat carbs and dietary fats at the same time. Split them up.

To keep mass while dieting-eat more red meat(Extremely lean 96/4% hamburger-Lean Top Round)

To lean out faster eat "cleaner" sources of protein (chicken breasts-turkey breasts-etc.etc.) and further reduce carbs.

Take EFA's To keep sanity, Brain function, memory, Joint health, Expidited Fat oxidation, and for Anti-catabolism purposes. (protection against muscle wasting)

Consume as much protein as your body can handle w/o getting digestion problems and as long as you have no bad kidney history. ALL CLEAN SOURCES.

Limit food intake to MOSTLY whole food meals and place less emphasis on artificial meals.

Absolutely NO_SUGAR_PERIOD!!! No Fruit, No Candy, No anything sugary! Yeah those grapes you like to eat...Kiss them goodbye.

Make sure your water intake is high (1-1/2 gallons worth) Ilove crystal light personally.

And Cardio....You absolutely have to do cardio period. Start with once in the morning before you eat a damn thing and do 30 minutes 5 days a week for the first few weeks. Then gradually increase that number to 45 minutes 6 days a week. Then monitor from there how much fat you still need to lose.

Final Words...you're doing this natural and don't be surprised if your fat doesn't just melt. You're not taking winstrol, deca, etc. so therefore don't expect "magazine" type of reductions.

These are just guidelines not absolutes...your body is different from mine so see if these things work for you. Remember dieting is a motherfucker-no way around it. You can either do it and reap the fruits of your labor, or you can go the easy way and not have shit to show under your shirt. Your choice bro, good luck.

No sugar period?? How about pre/post workout? That is the most anabolic time to spike your insulin for max gains.

[str8flexed]

Originally Posted by AlteredBeast

Number one; you need to prioritize. Do you want to Gain Muscle or Lose Fat, cause doing either one or the other is a more optimal plan. If you are trying to gain mass with the expectations of eventually slimming down to a sveltte 10% or lower, then this diet will work for you. If you want to slim down immeadiately then you better realize that you're not naturally thin and therefore you can't eat so many calories. You won't lose a damn thing on the current diet you're on now. I recently just finished my diet that I've been slaving over for over a year and half and I've discovered a few things about losing weight. I have a few rules you may want to incorperate into your regimine that has led to controlled, muscle-saving fat-loss.
First off, Reduce your carbs. The only time you need carbs is when you eat your first meal, and before and after you train. That's it, no more, no less(for now).

Second, Restrict ALL carb sources to strictly slow-digesting alternatives, meaning cut out the bagels, the breads, the pastas, the cereals, and starchy foods(White Potatoes-Red Potatoes-Corn, etc.)

Never Eat carbs and dietary fats at the same time. Split them up.

To keep mass while dieting-eat more red meat(Extremely lean 96/4% hamburger-Lean Top Round)

To lean out faster eat "cleaner" sources of protein (chicken breasts-turkey breasts-etc.etc.) and further reduce carbs.

Take EFA's To keep sanity, Brain function, memory, Joint health, Expidited Fat oxidation, and for Anti-catabolism purposes. (protection against muscle wasting)

Consume as much protein as your body can handle w/o getting digestion problems and as long as you have no bad kidney history. ALL CLEAN SOURCES.

Limit food intake to MOSTLY whole food meals and place less emphasis on artificial meals.

Absolutely NO_SUGAR_PERIOD!!! No Fruit, No Candy, No anything sugary! Yeah those grapes you like to eat...Kiss them goodbye.

Make sure your water intake is high (1-1/2 gallons worth) Ilove crystal light personally.

And Cardio....You absolutely have to do cardio period. Start with once in the morning before you eat a damn thing and do 30 minutes 5 days a week for the first few weeks. Then gradually increase that number to 45 minutes 6 days a week. Then monitor from there how much fat you still need to lose.

Final Words...you're doing this natural and don't be surprised if your fat doesn't just melt. You're not taking winstrol, deca, etc. so therefore don't expect "magazine" type of reductions.

These are just guidelines not absolutes...your body is different from mine so see if these things work for you. Remember dieting is a motherfucker-no way around it. You can either do it and reap the fruits of your labor, or you can go the easy way and not have shit to show under your shirt. Your choice bro, good luck.

if he's trying to gain muscle why only eat carbs at breakfast & pre/post training?

[The Brotherhood]

Originally Posted by AlteredBeast

Number one; you need to prioritize. Do you want to Gain Muscle or Lose Fat, cause doing either one or the other is a more optimal plan. If you are trying to gain mass with the expectations of eventually slimming down to a sveltte 10% or lower, then this diet will work for you. If you want to slim down immeadiately then you better realize that you're not naturally thin and therefore you can't eat so many calories. You won't lose a damn thing on the current diet you're on now. I recently just finished my diet that I've been slaving over for over a year and half and I've discovered a few things about losing weight. I have a few rules you may want to incorperate into your regimine that has led to controlled, muscle-saving fat-loss.
First off, Reduce your carbs. The only time you need carbs is when you eat your first meal, and before and after you train. That's it, no more, no less(for now).

Second, Restrict ALL carb sources to strictly slow-digesting alternatives, meaning cut out the bagels, the breads, the pastas, the cereals, and starchy foods(White Potatoes-Red Potatoes-Corn, etc.)

Never Eat carbs and dietary fats at the same time. Split them up.

To keep mass while dieting-eat more red meat(Extremely lean 96/4% hamburger-Lean Top Round)

To lean out faster eat "cleaner" sources of protein (chicken breasts-turkey breasts-etc.etc.) and further reduce carbs.

Take EFA's To keep sanity, Brain function, memory, Joint health, Expidited Fat oxidation, and for Anti-catabolism purposes. (protection against muscle wasting)

Consume as much protein as your body can handle w/o getting digestion problems and as long as you have no bad kidney history. ALL CLEAN SOURCES.

Limit food intake to MOSTLY whole food meals and place less emphasis on artificial meals.

Absolutely NO_SUGAR_PERIOD!!! No Fruit, No Candy, No anything sugary! Yeah those grapes you like to eat...Kiss them goodbye.

Make sure your water intake is high (1-1/2 gallons worth) Ilove crystal light personally.

And Cardio....You absolutely have to do cardio period. Start with once in the morning before you eat a damn thing and do 30 minutes 5 days a week for the first few weeks. Then gradually increase that number to 45 minutes 6 days a week. Then monitor from there how much fat you still need to lose.

Final Words...you're doing this natural and don't be surprised if your fat doesn't just melt. You're not taking winstrol, deca, etc. so therefore don't expect "magazine" type of reductions.

These are just guidelines not absolutes...your body is different from mine so see if these things work for you. Remember dieting is a motherfucker-no way around it. You can either do it and reap the fruits of your labor, or you can go the easy way and not have shit to show under your shirt. Your choice bro, good luck.

Good god, no offense, but I cringed, many times.

We have no idea if this diet will work for him or not, we have no macro breakdown, or his states (height, weight, bodyfat%). If I ate that kind of diet, depending on the portions, id probably be 1000cals in surplus, if Layne ate it, he might be 1000 cals in a deficit, its relative.

Nothing wrong with fruit, cutting or bulking.

Eating red meat doesnt make you retain mass, consuming enough protein to keep a positive nitrogen balance, NOT training on an empty stomach, and training balls to the wall will have you retaining mass.

Whether its slow digesting carbs or not doesn't really matter except for satiating yourself. Slower digesting (low GI ) carbs tend to have more fiber and be more filling (oats, etc), but theres nothing wrong with using higher GI carbs, especially post w/o, for nutrient absorbption.

Any routine, be it fat loss or muscle gain, should honestly have HIIT cardio incorporated. And starved state cardio is a HORRIBLE idea for various reasons:

1) The body is already in a highly catabolic state in the AM, exercising furthers this state and sharply increases probability of muscle oxidation for energy.

2) IT DOESNT MATTER how whether fat or food stores are used for energy during your cardio, total fat loss in a 24 hour period will be your caloric deficit, no more, no less.

Layne, please correct me if I messed up anywhere, im still learning.

[Jeff S.]

lets see: 9 meals (5 of which are synthetic), lots of carbs, , no vegies and a desire to get leaner. Personally, since we know nothing else, I would suggest document his body stats (BF, weight, etc.) and stay on his regimin 2-3 weeks. Re check stats and make changes in diet. Cut all carb foods white (except post wo) and eat more whole vs synthetic foods. Cardio in the am on empty stomach 2-3 times a week. Log everything. Re-eval in 3-4 weeks.