[flytrapcan]

Originally Posted by str8flexed

that's a tough call. i'm a lifetime drug free guy and ideally that's how all natural shows would be. However, I understand sometimes guys feel they made mistakes when they were younger and in my mind if they've been clean like 5-7 years, then I think that shows a genuine commitment to natural bodybuilding... sort of like a born again virgin lol. Some feds out there only have a 1 or 3 year drug free requirement and I think that's a little light. And then you have feds like musclemania.... where drug free is more of a suggestion than a requirement.

-Layne

Tough yes.

Here's my history.

- Did a test cycle 15 years ago after a BB comp.
- Took 3 - 4 years off, ummm damnn.
- Over the next couple of years I played around with working-out.
- Back and shoulder injury put me out for 9 months.
- Started again 3 years ago.
- At the urging of a friend I tried "this awesome supp" M1T!!!!!
- Did it 4 times before I realized it was poison (For gods sake educate yourself!)

So for the past 10 months I've been detoxifying and getting back into shape. I started M1 at 235 and now I'm back to 235.

My goal is to do a natty show next year. However, I still feel uneasy about my M1T experience last year.

It'll be 1 .5 years since the M1 experience at contest time.

Opinions

[shenanigans]

More of a suggestion than a requirement is so true, Most of the natural body builders I have met are taking orals all year and then banging GH right before the contests, it is a joke. I still can't condemn them though. Do whatcha like.

[flytrapcan]

Originally Posted by jampsifit

Well....not according to these guys...

theocbwebsite.com/BannedSubstances. htm

(p.s. i put spaces inbetween since i can't post links for now....)

ATD/ADT just got on the list recently, soooooooooo if u've used it thennnnn u've already lost ur natural virginity.....or if you do so after december of this year. I think thats when it goes into effect. So now i guess the only other thing would be 6 oxo, which is supposedly from a natural source (someone wanna verify this?).

I wonder how many federations are gonna follow this trend of banning the atd'z.

So you are natural until you take a newly banned product. You could have taken horse loads of a drug up until the ban, but as long as you switch to something else you are fine.

I guess until it's banned you might as well get as much growth from it as you can.

[str8flexed]

i don't see it that way. you should be true to yourself & your own ethical standards

[flytrapcan]

:) I was waiting for that response str8flexed, good on ya.

After my M1T fiasco I'm scared to touch anything.

Anybody know if products like Ecdysterone( think Scivations Anagen) or Ipriflavone (think Universal Animal M-Stak) are acceptable?

[str8flexed]

those are fine. not banned by any org

[flytrapcan]

Originally Posted by str8flexed

those are fine. not banned by any org

Thanks.

God it's nice to have finally found a natty focused forum.

[milesjhill]

Natural - n - produced or existing in nature; not manufactured

so, if the body or nature can produce it, then, isnt that natural?...

[trapmanjoe]

i beleive that natural is not putting any synthetic version of anything in your body.
ex)steroids are synthetic forms of test., tribulas is herbal and does not supress your natural test like steroids do. so i beleive tribulas,whey,creatine,bcaa's, even the growth hormone products out there in stores, its a whole different ball game when you get the real thing.

[kern247]

I believe that as long as nothing you take shuts your natural production of test down, there is really nothing wrong with it. If a BB wants to take a "plant extract" supplement, I don't believe there is anything unatural about it.

[biggerandbigger]

To me natrual is anything you can get "over the counter" and legal is ok. So any supps you buy from the store or online are fine, even though in my opinion most supps suck. Training and proper overall calorie intake is the key.

[str8flexed]

what would you say about the legal steroids that can be bought over the counter... these are full blown steroids. would you say they are natural?

[flytrapcan]

You have to do your research, or ask the right people, to stay natural. It's a game of rulings when you are trying to take borderline products, only to have a fedration rule them banned.

If you were to follow the guidlines to the letter, then in reality you would be able to indulge in the borderline products until they are put on a list. However, you'd still have to deal with the threat of sides.

There's politics as well. The debate with ephedrine, legal here and not there. Here in Canada I can't even get DHEA - now a banned substance. So a federations natrual guidelines in one country would cause you to fail in another.

For me natural means no AAS or Pro-Hormones. If you have to do Post Cycle Therapy for a product then you should just stay away.